We Don’t Need No Stinking Patches

Well, yeah, ok maybe we do. Especially if we’re running Vault. Somehow, the boys and girls in Manchester managed to get the patch for 2008 to play with ADMS (Vault) 2009 uploaded and it slipped by us. Read on for more info and the link.

In a continuing effort to provide high quality products, Autodesk has released the AutoCAD® Civil 3D® 2008 – Autodesk Vault 2009 (Server) support patch. AutoCAD® Civil 3D® 2008 includes the Autodesk Data Management Server (ADMS) 2008 and AutoCAD® Civil 3D® 2009 includes Autodesk Vault 2009 (Server) for AutoCAD® Civil 3D® version. The ADMS 2008 and the Autodesk Vault 2009 (Server) cannot be installed side-by-side on the same machine. This support patch will allow you to connect to the Autodesk Vault 2009 (Server) from AutoCAD® Civil 3D® 2008 (with Service Pack 2 installed), allowing you to upgrade to the new version of the server independent from your upgrade to Civil 3D® 2009. However, applying this support patch does not allow you to use AutoCAD® Civil 3D® 2009 drawings with ADMS 2008.

So, if you’re running 2008, and struggling to get all the upgrades done in a weekend, or want to update a few folks to 2009 while most of the firm is on 2008, here’s your golden ticket.


  1. tim wall says:

    No need for patches if you don’t use Vault. Vault with Civil 3D is a failure. Save yourself a lot of headache and don’t use it with Civil 3D.

  2. Why is Vault a failure, Tim? I won’t say it’s not, but throw out more than schtick….

  3. tim wall says:

    No schtick here. I have tested Vault extensively over a 4 month span and every test result shows me that my Civil 3D users are much better off without it. When I and my Civil CAD guys were testing out Vault, there was a significant loss in productivity, and my users hated using it. I didn’t find Vault to be efficient in production. While the Vault interface is easy to use, that is the only positive thing about it. As a Civil CAD guy for 22 years, CAD speed is everything, and if a software package doesn’t make your life at the CAD station easier, faster or more productive, it needs to bring something to the table that warrants using it. I’m sure some out there may disagree with me, but I sure could not find any companies using Civil 3D who sang Vault’s praises. Once we stopped using Vault, productivity and efficiency increased immediately. Matter of fact, our Chief Civil PE mandated we no longer use Vault under any circumstance.

  4. Now that’s an answer. Thanks for replying!

  5. Tommie Richardson says:

    Even though we don’t use Vault either, I do know a firm that swears by it. They can’t fathom how we work on large projects without it and we can’t fathom how they work with it at all. I guess it helps that they started using it one user at a time. That way most of the kinks and workflow issus were resolved up front. Then, as they added additional users, it was an easier transition for all.

  6. David Okonewski says:

    Vault success or failre is extremely dependant on workflow management. I have personally implemented Vault at several companies now. (Including one I was CAD Manager/Lead Designer) Both have roughly the same workflow which is rather odd. I suppose being trained by the same person had something to do with that. I will however disagree that Vault is not a useful tool for Civil 3D with one caveat … it is not the right tool for everyone. I recommend it on a case by case basis as I think that is the only proper way to do it.

    At the last firm I worked at before jumping to a reseller we ran Vault starting with 2007 when the Desk took away Data Shortcuts that we so widely used. Once everyone was trained and brought up to speed we saw a small increase in productivity based on the smaller and much more specific drawings that we were now able to produce.

    As with all things Civil 3D your results will vary.

  7. We’ve been using it since it started shipping with Civil 3D 2007. After a few bumps, it’s really proven to be a better method for us for sharing data in Civil 3D. Contrary to what Tim says, there’s a significant time savings in the process of creating the data reference vs. a data shortcut. Not to mention the gain of having Vault’s ability to understand the relationship if a filename or path ever changes, unlike data shortcuts.

    Some of the other great features we like about Vault is the ability to share files between offices which takes the manual copying and forgetting to copy back issue away from humans. It also makes taking files out of the office much easier for laptop users. We really like the Label feature inside Vault Explorer to create project milestones (such as 30/60/90% Submittals, Bid Sets, Permit Sets, etc.). Again, this way we’re not having to copy folders of files and such. It’s also nice to put the ability of grabing a version of a file from last week into the end-users hands.

    Once a user grasps the concept of a data management system vs. direct disk access to a hard drive or file server, the rest is gravy.

  8. tim wall says:

    I have to agree with David, Vault is not the right tool for everyone. I could see how Vault could work well with a multi-office configuration.

    As for us, Vault simply did not add to the overall efficiency & productivity of our workers. The success stories are far outweighed by those who have tried it and found it not useful.

  9. Eric Rohlfs says:

    Tim, what is your role at your company. It was a learning curve for our users and all end users hate change.

    I’m the IT manager, and we had to move to vault so we could break up our projects into smaller parts. You could not buy a computer that was fast enough to do the calculations we needed civil 3d to do. Also, the fact that users can get their own previous versions is better for the users and IT. My background is programming and when I started working in CAD environments, I could not believe that cad did not have a Project Management / Document Management system.

    I know some IT departments hate vault because they are not database savvy.

  10. Jon Rizzo says:

    The primary reason to use vault in 2007 and 2008 was because the desk made data shortcuts such a pain to use. Now that they have overhauled the data shortcut UI, the argument is much less strong for Vault. As a file management system, Vault is rather weak. I would rather see a Sharepoint web part that replaces Vault. However, it does provide some performance benefit when working across T1 lines, because you don’t have to traverse the WAN every time you want to save the file.

  11. tim wall says:

    I am IS CAD Support, with a strong Civil background.

    My biggest problem was Vault had been poorly implemented before my arrival, and my job was to fix all the problems my users were having. While researching the problems, I had to configure user accounts (some Tech Support moron told us – before my arrival – not to use individual user accts), various Working Folder locations, and our Vault configuration was bypassing our current project server structure. Once I got Vault set up correctly, we discovered it wasn’t all that great.

  12. Matt Kolberg says:

    A word of caution about this patch. Well maybe not caution, but….anyway, I can’t think of the word…

    READ THE README. I know it sounds obvious, but if you don’t you may end up in trouble. Believe me, I know. Nuff said.


  13. Dean Turner says:

    It’s all in the workflow! If this is not setup correctly and your templates are not up to snuff, then yes, your Vault will not help things.

    If you work on large scale subdivisions with 5+ people working on the project simultaneously, then Vault is the BOMB!!! It makes it well worth the heartache to get it going correctly. Like previous posts: Prior versioning, saved milestones, multiple user access very easily and dynamically.

    The one caveat I have is, Administration, Administration, Administration!!! If you don’t keep your vault clean of unesscessary versions, the project can go South real quick!